Creatives Like Us Podcast - Ep6: Makeda Matheson
"We have a very London-centric view of Blackness in the UK, but Black people exist everywhere. Our stories deserve to be told too" - Makeda Matheson.
In this episode of Creatives Like Us, host Angela Lyons speaks with filmmaker, writer, and producer Makeda Matheson about her unexpected journey into the creative industry. Beginning her career in fashion styling in New York, Makeda transitioned into filmmaking and TV writing, demonstrating that persistence and self-belief can open doors, even without industry connections. She discusses how celebrity stylist Robert Verdi became a vital mentor, the challenges of breaking into film, and why black stories, particularly those beyond London, deserve more representation in media.
Makeda also discusses taking risks, trusting her instincts, and how her teenage dream of working with Chanel has come full circle in a way she never anticipated. She now concentrates on writing and directing fictional films, bringing fresh northern black voices to UK screens.
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Visit Makeda's website: https://www.makedamatheson.com/
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Chapters/Timestamp
Introducing Makeda Matheson
How did you get started with work?
What work did you do on the TV show 'The Voice'?
What projects on you working on currently?
How was Robert Virdi a catalyst for change for you?
What would you tell your teenage self?
Transcript
Makeda
I think that as black women, we're seen as being monoliths, you know, that were just one type of person, and so once they’ve told that one story, then they're like, oh, but we've, we've done it, we told the story about a black woman like, so it's done.
Angela
So they've ticked that box.
Makeda
They tick that box.
It was a very difficult time, and it remains a very difficult time to, to get into the creative industry and sustain a creative career, especially with everything we're talking about with AI and all this stuff, I think it very much is a time of devaluing what it means to, to lead a creative life,
Intro
Hello and welcome to Creatives Like Us, where I speak with creatives of colour, who share journeys and stories and ideas, and how they can inspire and open up avenues in creative industries. I'm your host, graphic designer Angela Lyons, and with the help of my guests, I will bring insightful interviews and compelling stories that can inspire you to think about things differently or shape your next move. Being a creative of colour can bring its challenges - highs and lows and in betweens, but this podcast is about amplifying our voices and celebrating together. So are you ready? Let's get started with Creatives Like Us.
Anglea
Hello and welcome to Creatives Like Us. And today we're talking to Makeda Matheson, and I'm really excited to have her with us, and I really can't wait to hear about her journey and how she's starting, and what she's got dreams for the future. So over to you, Makeda. Tell us a bit about yourself.
Makeda
Hi Ange! My name is Makeda, as you've said, and I'm a filmmaker. I'm from Huddersfield, originally, now based in London, and I work across commercial and documentary film, and I also write TV.
Angela
Perfect. Oh, you also write TV?
Makeda
Yeah. I also write TV, yeah.
Angela
Would that be something that we've seen, or is it TV in the UK, or is it TV abroad, or?
Makeda
That is, like, my new COVID activity, really. For the last 13 years now, I've been making commercial film and documentary. And then during COVID, I was like, well, I got all this time on my hands, and, you know, I'd been around other screenwriters, and I was like, do you know what? Let me try doing that - the stories I want to tell, not necessarily in the documentary space, because the people I want to tell those stories about aren't here anymore. So I tried writing my first script, and I entered into a couple of competitions. It got long listed, and that's why I've been chipping away at ever since, just hoping to have something made. So yeah, many are scripted in the world, but I'm still waiting for them to come to actuation, apart from one thing I did for the BFI, which actually did get made, which was lovely.
Angela
Oh that’s cool. So just going back to that. Sorry, I know we're going to talk about how you got into it and everything, but just as we're here, you said you got into a long list, what was that for?
Makeda
Oh, so long listing. So when you enter into these script writing competitions or open calls, at first, you'll be long listed, which means that you've been whittled down to the next stage, let's say, like the semi finals, or actually, let's say the quarter finals, and then the semi finals will be being shortlisted. So that's when you know you go from so 1000 applicants originally, the long list might be 500, and then the short list will be 12, let's say, and then it'll be 1 or 2 people selected from that so your odds aren't great, but it's still a really good exercise in knowing that you've got something to say. Because it is hard getting from 1000 or 5000 to 100 and then to 50. So it's actually a really good exercise for you as a writer to know that whatever you have to say is worth that next round, or that second, that further round. Because essentially, to win a lot of these competitions, you have to be like showing that you can reinvent the wheel, and essentially spar with the people who are doing it, top of their game, to just get in the door. Which I always think is so interesting with these industries, how you have to be great before you get paid to do that job, and you then have to show that you're exponentially better than 2000, 3000 people before you get the opportunity. But then, I suppose your counterpart, who just knows somebody within the industry, just gets that opportunity, and they can be okay, whereas, like, you have to be exceptional to get through that way, which a lot of people do have to go through that process.
Angela
It's interesting, especially to say some, you have to know someone to get into certain industries. I find that, when I first started out as a graduate, you had to know someone, like my first work experience, is because I knew somebody in a design studio, and that was because their brother worked there, and they knew that I was a graphic designer. I wanted experience, and I was just like, gosh, if I never met that person, how would I've gotten in, obviously, would have gone the long route round and said, sent off the applications. But how many of those actually get seen? So I suppose in your industry, also, you'd have to, is it a lot of knowing people?
Makeda
Yeah, I think so. I didn't know anybody, unfortunately, but it was that you would apply for so many different things to try and get in. And then once you're in, you do realise like, that you have so many applications coming in all the time, and when a roles up, it could be hundreds for this one entry level position. So there's a lot of competition. And then the people who did get in a lot of time, you'd be like, oh, it's the boss's son, or it was literally the boss's son's best friend. And so it is still that. I think the creative industry is a relationships industry across the board. I think we can say that for all creators, that is the case. There's a reason why Sophia Coppola is a director, because her father is also in the industry. But then at the same time, you can say that it's because she's been around it, so she does understand it to a great extent and level, because she's learning by osmosis all the time, which is its own privilege. But yeah, I definitely found that was the case, and it was really hard getting that start, because it was just. and it was also, I started around the time of the recession. So it was that, there wasn't that many roles. And I think it was also a time when companies found out they could call something an internship and pay someone nothing for a role that they traditionally, yeah, for a role that was required. Yeah, did you, yeah? So it was like this weird time, like, wait a minute, so I can call it an internship, and then pay them nothing for a role that is completely like, necessary, required. We need this person, but then we can save their salary, and then if, when that person has enough, we can cycle in the next person.
Angela
We can say your internship has ended now…
Makeda
Yeah, the money, your internship has ended.
Angela
That's not fair.
Makeda
But that was the case.
Angela
I think the UK lot, I'm not too sure, not quite, don't quote me this, but I think it must have changed now for internships, because that'd be horrendous if it - I'm sure it's changed by now, because they must have noticed that a lot of students weren't, and interns weren't getting paid. And they were doing a salaried role. So it's not fair, actually, let's talk about, how did you start? Seen as we're talking about, you started from the recession, what year was that?
Makeda
I can't remember. All my years mixed up, but I started working when I was 16. So even when I did work experience in high school, I got a job in like, a local shop, like a skate shop, because I was like, retail is my thing, fashion's my thing. So I need to, like, have this, this work experience in a shop, so then I can get a job in one of the shops in Leeds (I’m from Huddersfield). So let's get one of the jobs in a shop in Leeds. So I need to have this, like, little thing for my CV for when I go hand it around, which would have been in the early 2000s. And then from that, I was like, Oh, I'm going to be in fashion. And I was like, oh, art history. So I did art history at university because I thought I'd love to be the archivist at Chanel. I was like, that's what I want to do. I love fashion. I was like, I want to be the editor of Vogue. And I was like, no, actually, fashion's kind of mean, okay, let me be the archivist at Chanel. They have these massive collections and these vaults. That's what I want to do with my life. I did some museum work. And I was like, actually, absolutely not. I'm too loud for museum work, so then…
Angela
As in a library, I’ve got to be quiet? Or as in loud personality?
Makeda
Yeah, all of it. I did some work at the V&A, and I was like, oh no, I'm not one of these gals. They're great.
Angela
That’s so funny.
Makeda
But actually, that time, when we were talking about this kind of system where it was only a certain type of person who was a, who was really getting into those spaces, and I was not that type of person in many ways. And so I was really lucky that I have an aunt that lives in New York, and when I went on my gap year after college, I went and stayed with her in Manhattan, and I started, like, doing fashion internships in New York. And I was like, Oh, this is wonderful, I would like, love to work in fashion. And then I wasn't sure how, like, really, what shape that would take. But on my last day of that internship, I actually met a celebrity stylist called Robert Virdi. He was picking up some outfits for Eva Longoria and an actress from Sopranos, which was a big show.
Angela
Oh wow, big shots!
Makeda
Yeah so I met him, and he was just like, we were just like, we had this moment of being like, you look great. Like, we were just like, obsessed with your outfit. So it's one of those like, kind of moments. And he was like, you should come and work for me. I was like, oh, I'm going back to England tomorrow. And he was like, Yeah, next time you're here, let me know. And so I never planned to go back to New York again for another stint, because I was there for three months, but because he said, I was like, do you know what? I had nothing to lose, I was 19 at the time. So I saved up my money, and then I went back, and I called him when I got back to New York, and I was like, can I still come work with you? He was like, of course! And so I ended up working with him for another few months, and then went back to England, and then did a year of university, and then went back and worked for him for another summer. And that was styling Eva Longoria, Hugh Jackman, Kathy Griffin, randomly. She was one of his clients as well, the comedian. And just traversing kind of Fashion Avenue, which I think is seventh with him, and just having this real Sex in the City moment.
Angela
I was about to say, you sound like Sex In The City!
Makeda
It was a real moment. I'm like, 20, I'm wearing, like, you know, Alexander McQueen, like every day, like, you know, tottering up and down. I was wearing heels all the time. Like, it was just, it was really that time of, like, doing that thing. When you're 19, you have so much disposable income because you live at home, and if you work, then you've got money to buy yourself some shoes. And I don't, I think fashion was more accessible at that point as well. The same bag I read the other day on Business of Fashion, since COVID, a Chanel 255 bag has gone, it's doubled in price since then. So it becomes less and less accessible. But there was always great sales in like these big retailers like Harrods. Do you remember, like they used to have a massive sale, and you could go in and find that pair of shoes, like, 70% off. And that doesn't really happen in the same way now, because they don't really have sales on some designer brands.
But yeah, so I was able to have this like experience there. So it was just like a time when I think that fashion was more accessible. I don't think I would be able to do that thing now, because all these things are triple the price they were at that time. So it wouldn't be that. I just wanted people to know that, like, oh yeah, no, Lowes on a Tuesday. No, not these days. And so, yeah. So I had this amazing experience working in New York, and it was just…Oh. It just opened my eyes to, like, the possibilities of the world. And I think we'll return to Robert Verdi later, because, yeah, he was definitely very instrumental in just building myself, my confidence in myself and what was possible for me.
You know, coming from Huddersfield that you don't really live this lifestyle, I was so lucky to have a lot of creative people in my sphere. Like all my mum's sisters are makers. My dad's a cabinet builder. So being creative is just like a given in my family, and we're always, like, very interested in interiors and fashion. So that was always part of our, like, language as a family, and it still is, but he was definitely very important to kind of being like, oh, this could be your future, some sort of creative endeavor. So… worked in fashion styling, came back to England, tried working in fashion styling here, and was like, Oh, it's a very different environment, especially at that time. This isn't really for me, but I got some assisting work on The Voice, as in The Voice? What's the voice? The Voice newspaper?
Makeda
‘This is the voice’ No, the music show, like with the chairs that spin around.
Angela
Oh, actually The Voice, the TV show, because in the UK, we have a newspaper called the Voice.
Makeda
Yes, and actually my cousin worked for that paper for a very long time.
Angela
Ohh, oh really? But so The Voice, the TV show with Tom Jones and Will.i.am? So you worked with The Voice. So what did you do there?
Makeda
I was assisting the stylist for it. So it was styling all the contestants. And that was definitely a time when I was like, Oh, this feels like busy work to me. A lot of the things that we were doing, it felt like it was unnecessary in some way. So she was very nice, I remember, but I saw everyone in production, I was like, Oh, I can do what they do. I'd been working in event styling in London, and I was like, it's all production. So I was like, Oh, I can apply the things I've learned through like, event styling to this. And so that's when I was like, do you know what? I'm 24, let me go backwards and start in film. I think it would be nice to work on something that's more permanent than what I've been doing before.
Angela
Ah. So the production, when you saw the actual production, you actually saw the production of The Voice, and you thought, Oh, this is something that I could get into.
Makeda
Yeah
Angela
Amazing, amazing.
Makeda
So then I got an internship in a film company, and they hired me on the first day. So then I just worked my way up in that film company over five years, so…
Angela
I hope they paid you!
Makeda
They did pay me, it was a day, but they paid me!
Angela
Oh that’s perfect then! Because sometimes these internships can last for three months. We need you for the three months, you’ll get lots of experience.
Makeda
Oh gosh, that was my experience until that point with internships, but yeah, but it's very modest. It was like, they pay me, like, entry level, minus, I feel like that salary was, but it was enough for me to live in London, eke out some sort of existence. And then I, yeah, I just worked myself, my way up in that company, and as a producer, like worked my way for the producer, and then I was naturally going on these smaller shoots because it was documentary and commercial film. But it was at that time when the internet native film was becoming more and more popular, and lots of brands were doing that, and branded film was becoming a thing. So I was going on these shoots all over the world with just me, a cameraman and a soundie, and not calling it directing when that's what it was. And then I was like, wait a minute, wait a minute. Let me get my flowers and start calling it what it is.
Angela
You deserve them.
Makeda
Exactly. Yeah, I took a leap and played for myself, became freelance and yeah, that's what I've been doing ever since. And in the last few years, I've been working at CNN as a senior producer and director, and, yeah, writing TV and working on my own documentary project, projects outside of that as well. Yeah.
Angela
It's been taken us to present day?
Makeda
That's taken us to present day.
Angela
About now, what projects would, are you working on? I know you said you're working on documentaries, but what would like a day to day, like, what are you doing today, later on, after we speak, what are you doing tomorrow? So what is the latest? The latest project that you've got on at the moment?
Makeda
So I've been working on a campaign for Turkey Tourism for the last three years, and we, I was in Turkey for two weeks this year, and so we're finishing up those films, and then working on the renewal of that. So I think it's going to come back again for next year. So I'll spend more time in Turkey, so looking at some edits for those. And then I'm working on a project for Hyundai about female athletes, speaking to one of them later, a perspective for a film that we hopefully will make next month. And then I'm working on a film about a golf course in the Middle East. And promoting playing golf in the Middle East.
Angela
Wow. These are all so, the projects are all so different. How are you… it's like from Turkey to athletes to golf. It's just in tourism. It's just, that's really cool. And how do you like get those projects? Don't just tell your secrets, obviously. But is it people, or is it people like you just contact them, or they see your work and think, Oh, I'll contact Makeda.
Makeda
Yeah I mean, that work comes through CNN. So it's like, people come to CNN because they want to have governments, brands, come to CNN, because they want to have their product on CNN’s platforms. So, they come to us, now, this is a good idea, and then that's where I come into this.
Angela
Oh, brilliant.
Makeda
They come for CNN and they stay for Makeda. Who knows.
Angela
They come for CNN. They come as the CNN CC, and they come for the creativity of you! Perfect.
So you was talking about the fashion designer in New York, because I'm always interested in like, people's careers path, and how that one person or, that one, it could be one person, it could be a few people, that actually came into their life, and obviously your aunt came into your life and changed your, you went and lived with her, and that changed the direction of the path that you were going. You mentioned the fashion designer, can you tell me a little bit more about him and how he was the catalyst change in your career?
Makeda
Yeah, it's interesting. We're still friends now.
Angela
Oh, are you? Amazing!
Makeda
Yeah. So I saw him actually a few weeks ago when he was in London. So his name's Robert Virdi, and he's a celebrity stylist. And so he was very popular on TV in America. A lot of those kind of like how to dress type shows. And then he styled, like, Eva Longoria, Hugh Jackman, people like that. And so when I was working for him, I'd go to events with him, or we just talked to each other, because we just kind of got, we just got on, and we still get on. And he would just talk about my future like it was a given, like he'd be like…
Angela
Wow, that's powerful.
Makeda
Eventually you'll own your own house, and you'll go to this type of thing, and you'll do this type of thing. And he just said it like it was just like the inevitable. And him saying it in that way made me believe that it also could just happen in that way, like it could be an, it is inevitable, this person who has achieved these things, thinks that I also have whatever it is, that drive that got them to where they are, and they just think that, Oh, it's a given. So yeah, it definitely empowered me to weather the storms, which there were a lot of them, because it was a very difficult time, and it remains a very difficult time to, to get into the creative industry and sustain a creative career, especially with everything we're talking about with AI and all this stuff. I think it very much is a time of devaluing what it means to lead a creative life. But it was definitely like, I could always go back when, you know, I got those rejections, and be like, he thinks I'm great, and he knows these things are coming up. And so I can think that, oh, keep taking these leaps of faith in yourself, because other people have, and they have paid off, and generally it does always pay off taking these risks in some way.
Angela
Yeah, and it's amazing that he actually, and powerful, I say not amazing, powerful, that he actually told you that, because Makeda back then would have said, No, that's not my path. That's not for me. But he actually made you think that it is you and you can do this. And I just love it when people empower other people to believe in themselves. And I know people have done that with me along my journey too, and it's just, and my career, and it's just you have to look back at them and give them their thanks too. And it's just yeah, so lovely to hear about Robert. That's amazing. It's good that you're still friends!
Makeda
Yeah. And I actually had the opportunity to say this to him as well this year, because this is
we're talking 20 years ago at this point, and I’m now the age he was when we met.
Angela
Wow.
Makeda
Yeah. And so I said it to him, and I think it was very it was important for him as well to hear it, you know, yeah, it was a nice moment.
Angela
I hope you bought dinner!
Makeda
I did buy dinner actually, I did. It was like buying my dad dinner or something. It was just, it was a moment.
Angela
It was a moment, brilliant!
So we've talked about where you've been, and where you are now, and what does the future hold for Makedaand, um, obviously not, not today, tomorrow, or it could be today, tomorrow. But what is your like, the big dream that you would love to do, and where would you like to be? What would you like to do with your career? Have you manifested? Shall we manifest now?
Makeda
Yes, do you know it's always really great when you know you're going to have a conversation like this, and it makes you think about these things, like, what it is, what is it that you want? Where is it that you think you're going? I think that we're in such a massive period of recalibration in the creative industries, and we're really having to think about what it'll mean, 2,3,4,10 years in the future, to lead a creative life, which can also support you.
The industry. It's just everything is changing very quickly because of AI and a lot of other things. So yeah, I was thinking, what is it that I actually see in the future for myself? And I thought writing TV and fiction films. So hopefully, like, I'm writing TV and fiction films, so hopefully getting something made over the next year and building my TV directing chops further. I directed a lot of commercial film, a lot of documentary. I'd like to actually direct some actors, because it's all acting. No matter what you do, you think that you don't have transferable skills until you're in those rooms. You're like, Wait a minute. It's the same thing. It's just, you know, there's a script to adhere to.
Angela
Yeah, that's amazing. You said that because it's funny, like we were saying about the fashion designers and styling, their actors too, aren't they? Because they're going to be the actors for the stage, and they're going to be on stage and being the props. Yeah, it's just transferable. Everything's transferable.
Makeda
Everything’s transferable, everything, yeah. And then hopefully having something made, like a TV idea of mine about, I only write about Northern black peoples, hopefully something about Northern black people.
Angela
Oh really that’s so cool. Why is that not on the BBC or ITV or Channel Four, Channel Five? Why not?
Makeda
Because we have a very London centric view of blackness, that is purported through the BBC and all the different channels we have, which is so removed from the experience to us elsewhere. And so, I mean, there's a drive to get more content about people living in other places, across the board, whether you're black or else wise. We still need to tell these stories about everybody living their lives. It's not about cutting or telling less of those stories. It's about just opening up to telling…
Angela
Different, other stories. More and more other stories.
Makeda
Yeah it's about telling stories of other experiences, so that we understand, like, what this country is made up of.
Angela
Yeah, yeah, it's funny. Yes, it's so true, because I obviously at the moment on the TV, so a lot of the programs and dramas on TV at the moment are based around London, aren't they? And it's just a shame that we can't get other parts of the UK involved, and there are black people other than just London.
So two questions there, why is it not focusing on London? And also, why do we also have to focus on the stereotypes of what a Londoner, or a black Londoner should be? For example, I know that I'm not that stereotype. I always see that on TV. And I think people think there must be other black people that are not like the normal, oh gosh. I don't want to say the names, because I really rate what she's done and she's put it out there. But Candice Brathwaite, for example. And there's a lot of the girls that go clubbing and all that. We're not all like that. We just have regular jobs or regular families. Are they not exciting enough maybe, to tell the story? Or can't we make things exciting around us?
Makeda
Yeah, I think it's so many different, like, kind of threads to pull there. I think that as black women, we're seen as being monoliths, you know, that were just one type of person. And so once they told that one story, then they're like, oh, but we've, we've done it, we told the story about a black woman, like, so it's done.
Angela
So they've ticked that box.
Makeda
They've ticked that box. And I think it's also where those decisions are made from as well. In that, most of the film industry, the real decision making still happens in London. So it's generally a commissioners. They're always, everybody is always writing from their perspective, or receiving content from their perspective, and putting it through like that, their machine of their experience. So putting it through, oh, I've lived in London. I might be a white person who lives in London, but I have contact with black people in black communities, so I understand that. Whereas, when you talk, talk to somebody about the very vibrant Caribbean communities that we have in Yorkshire, Huddersfield has a massive one, where I'm from, and Leeds and even Bradford has quite a large Caribbean Community, most of the time, people will say, wait a minute, sorry. Like they assume that I'm the only black person in Huddersfield, and therefore that my narratives will always be bound to the struggle of being the only one in a context or in a place, which is not my experience.
I think that it's generally always the case for marginalised groups, that the understanding that is had by the people who make decisions about what to commission and all these things, that like, that our experience of life is always bound to our otherness, our blackness, our femaleness, our religion, whatever it is, whereas, actually, I don't know about you, but I don't think about white people at all during the day. I don't think about that because I'm just, this is my only life. I'm only having this experience, and I write about just normal things like relationships, breaking up, making up, what it means to exist within a family, generational trauma, generational joy, laughter. Because these are just human experiences, and actually, there's so much beauty in getting specific in those human experiences, because that's when people really like key into it. I can watch Abilene Elementary, for example. I've never been to Philadelphia. I've never been a teacher in a public school. I have been a child, and I love it when they're very specific in their experience, because then that opens up the world to me wider. I mean, like, Oh, I didn't know that I could go to Philadelphia and have something like a Philly cheese steak. And I understand where I can go and get it, because this program told me about this very specific experience.
So I think it's about who commissions content and where they are based often affects it. But then I also think we're in a time of a lot of narrowing of these industries, where BBC funding was cut by 50% this year, so that means that there's gonna be a lot less made. And then what's gonna be made? It's gonna be things that they know are sure hits. So it's gonna be by people you already heard of, and I understand that's a business decision, that makes sense. You know that people will tune in the content by Sally Wainwright, who made Happy Valley, great, right? Or a book that's been a bestseller, which I think a lot of that, like you were saying earlier, that there's a lot of adapted screenplays from books, so a lot of programs that are like based on books, because, yet again, you know that you have a built in audience. So I understand why that is the case, but it does mean that we miss out on a lot of people's experiences, and maybe a widening of the viewerships of these platforms, because I think a lot of people are actually turning off because they're like, Oh, it's another thing about this. It's another police procedural. It's another story about this specific problem, in this specific place. So I just want to hear people's stories.
Angela
I’m gonna set a manifestation for you, like Robert did, and I think that you should be the head of the BFI one day, and I'm gonna leave it there for you. And um, you'll have a think about that!
I'd love to know, what would you tell your teenage self?
Makeda
Gosh, this is always such like a hard question, and I was thinking about this recently because there's so many, there's so many films now about that experience, like of going back and telling your younger self XYZ, or what you’d do differently. And the first thing that always comes to mind is mine, for me, is wear your retainer, and it’s not a creative thing! You had braces for two years, wear the retainer, or they will move back, eat less sweets. Wear your retainer, eat less sweets. And I was like, take chances. And know the leaps of faith you take in yourself will always yield some positive results, because that is something that I think for a long time, especially in my 20s, I was always very like, shy, trigger shy, or, like, just worried about doing those things, like, oh, but if I do this thing, what will happen? And actually, when I became more confident in myself, or I just was like, Do you know what? It'll be fine. And I started taking these leap of faith. Firstly, when I went freelance, it worked out. So just do that more often. You want to go live in France. Go live in France. Learn a language as well, 15 year old Makeda, keep up with the French classes. Just move to, be an au pair. Move to France. Do it.
Angela
Yeah, especially now with all your traveling.
Makeda
Exactly! And in one year, because I directed a series of films for Chanel. So full circle moment, I wanted to be the archivist at Chanel, and I ended up working for them, just in a different capacity many years later.
Angela
Wow! Oh my gosh.
I feel like I could talk to you for ages, Makeda, about your career, who you've worked with, or who you've met.
Makeda
But that was the thing. It was like, this full circle moment. So, you know. And I also feel like in that moment, I was like, do you know what, teenage Makeda would be like? Do you know what things are alright aren’t they! Yeah I know that Makeda!
Angela
You did alright girl!
Makeda
Wear your retainer! And now you're in France all the time, you can't speak French! And all that Duolingo time you do?
Angela
Oh, I knew we’d get to Duolingo. Oh, my God.
Makeda
Are you still doing your streak?
Angela
No, I got to 1002 days and I was still going and I thought, No, I'm not doing this because I need to go, like you said, I need to go and live in the country to learn a language properly. I can say, like “foreign word”, and “foreign word”.
So let's have a quick five fire questions and you just gotta say, one or the other. Okay, yeah, crisp or chocolate?
Makeda
Crisp.
Angela
Beach or forest?
Makeda
Beach.
Angela
Book or Kindle?
Makeda
Book.
Angela
Reggae or Soul?
Makeda
Reggae.
Angela
Patty or Sandwich?
Makeda
I think that this is preposterous… Ohh sandwich.
Angela
Okay, interesting, this is preposterous, not had that answer yet, but thanks!
Makeda
If you did like fried eggs or sandwich, I’d be like ooh.
Angela
I should have said, like dumplings or something like that, the last one, and it's not on the list, but just, I'd love to know what your favorite film is. I know you're into - that's your career. What is your favourite film?
Makeda
Willy Wonka's Chocolate Factory, the Gene Wilder version.
Angela
Amazing.
Makeda
I love it so much. It shaped me as a storyteller, as a filmmaker, and just the way I almost live my life to some extent, like that. I mean, I do, like, you know, obviously this is an audio medium, but this house is a little bit like the imagination room.
Angela
Oh perfect, lovely.
Makeda
It's just the songs, the acting, oh, it's just all of it.
Angela
The colour!
Makeda
It's a feast for your eyes. I remember we took the tape out from Huddersfield library, and I didn't return it, and I actually ended up taking off the label and then writing one of these ‘property of Makeda Matheson’ stickers. I don't think I could go back to Huddersfield library now, because it's been out for 30 years. I’ve seen that film so many times back and I go back and watch it, and it still gives me that much pleasure. Think about it all the time. I made a joke about it just yesterday, like Grandpa Joe, he's bedridden until they get a golden ticket, then he's up doing this little soft shoe across the floor.
Angela
It was like a little shuffle innit.
Makeda
The deceit of Grandpa Joe, those four in the bed, while mum's out working all day.
Angela
I know, it’s just that whole story is just, I'd say that it's just crazy and just beautiful at the same time. It's just so funny and colourful. I love the colour.
Makeda
It’s amazing, and the super saturated way it's shot as well.
Angela
And it’s old, so it’s the old version. Yeah.
Makeda
Oh, perfection.
Angela
Perfect, perfect. And on that note, thank you so much, Makeda for joining me. It's been a real pleasure and a delight talking to you. And just to let you know that Makeda has got a wonderful art piece behind her, and that is by her brother, and it's just so gorgeous. So maybe I'll put these up on YouTube. Who knows. But thank you, Makeda. It's been a real pleasure. Oh, let me, let me ask. Let me ask. How can people find out about you? I'll obviously put it in the notes when we go live in the show notes and the links, but if you've got any links or where people can follow you online or your website or a newsletter, do let us know. Can let me know now.
Makeda
Yeah so I’m on Instagram @makedamathesonfilm, or at @makedamatheson. I'm one of those people who has two accounts. We didn't go all into this, but I used to have a cashmere knitwear brand, and so I have that account, and then I have my film one as well, so those two are out there. So yeah, give me a follow, and every so often I do update it I promise!
Angela
Brilliant. Thanks a lot Makeda!
Makeda
Thank you!
Outro
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